Now is the time.

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Chocolate Eclair
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Now is the time.

Post by Chocolate Eclair » Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:29 am

Well we are doing our bits in different ways to attract tourism for the future, but to me and a few others there are things that need looking at before the tourists return and now while the tourists are away is the time to start, I am talking about giving Luxor a face lift, repair the broken pavements, employ proper street cleaning methods, install more rubbish bins around the city, start enforcing that half built places get completed, and in general give the place a good painting to stop it looking dull and uninviting.

Not every tourist wants to walk on the road because of missing and broken paving slabs, not everyone wants to cross at crossings where drivers ignore the fact there is a public crossing, there is work that could be done to hide the fact there are burned out buildings around a popular tourist attraction, the litter is terrible, public toilets are a must there are very few of them, they seem to have gone forgotten about in favour of numerous ATM machines. We cannot get rid of tanks and military vehicles off the streets yet, but they put people off, eventually they will go, but for the time being its now, while things are quiet when investment is needed to welcome tourists back, unfortunately Luxor has fallen into decline over the past couple of years, and needs to pull itself out of the doldrums, its going to be hard, its going to take time, but now is the time to start.

Was it 2010 when we saw the Christmas Lights in Luxor welcoming guests? for the past 3 years Luxor has looked like a graveyard at Christmas uninviting and dull.

I know I will get criticism for writing this, but its true, even places back in England get a face lift during the low season. So onward and upward, lets make Luxor inviting and clean looking to provide a proper welcome to tourists.



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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Who2 » Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:53 am

May I suggest you put your points in a letter to King Abdhulla of SA....:cool:
"The Salvation of Mankind lies in making everything the responsibility of All"
Sophocles.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by LivinginLuxor » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:19 am

Strange, many people have said that the town looks cleaner now! However, I can agree on the broken pavements and litter bins - little capital expenditure, and work provided for the unemployed. Many of the half finished buildings though are family homes, where the extra floor wouldn't get finished until the son was to get married.
I might agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong!
Stan

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by LivinginLuxor » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:19 am

Strange, many people have said that the town looks cleaner now! However, I can agree on the broken pavements and litter bins - little capital expenditure, and work provided for the unemployed. Many of the half finished buildings though are family homes, where the extra floor wouldn't get finished until the son was to get married.
I might agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong!
Stan

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Dusak » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:34 am

:urm: Dashavu.
Life is your's to do with as you wish- do not let other's try to control it for you. Count Dusak- 1345.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Who2 » Tue Sep 03, 2013 8:55 am

On second thoughts perhaps King Abdhulla wouldn't fancy seeing his picture on litter bins and public conveniences...:cool:
"The Salvation of Mankind lies in making everything the responsibility of All"
Sophocles.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Chocolate Eclair » Tue Sep 03, 2013 9:59 am

L in L, I was talking more of business premises rather than private homes, take for example Ragab and Sons, there are 2 stories above that are just concrete pillars and nothing else, a certain hotel, got started but now seems to have stopped, Roca Forte, (OK you may say well there are no tourists) but that will not be forever and many of these Hotels are part of a chain so investment should not be an issue. The streets are filling up with pot holes, these can easily be repaired, providing work for locals, even proper street cleaning with the proper equipment would not go amiss, there is a problem with this though I know, its seems to be acceptable to many to throw things into the streets or brush them under a nearby parked car, so how do you stop this.
Everyone knows that begging in the streets is totally unacceptable in Europe, so the streets need to be cleaned up of these people, some are richer than the majority of ex pats. Its just that Luxor has been neglected over the past 2 years, I would think this is mainly a financial thing rather than a cannot be bothered thing, but unfortunately you have to invest to accumulate. At the moment its heartbreaking to see the neglect Luxor has suffered over the past 2-3 years. Cruise Boats laid up, Taxi Drivers driving around with long faces, the calesh numbers have dropped dramatically due to lack of work. on the whole the spirit of Luxor seems to have had its heart ripped from it.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by HEPZIBAH » Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:54 am

Chocolate Eclair wrote: Everyone knows that begging in the streets is totally unacceptable in Europe, so the streets need to be cleaned up of these people, some are richer than the majority of ex pats.
Begging in the streets in Europe may be totally unacceptable but nevertheless it happens. However, you are not in Europe you are in Egypt where the standard of living, on the whole, has been much lower than that of much of Europe for a very long time.
What is it though that is 'totally unacceptable'? The fact that so many people have been reduced to begging on the streets, or (and by the tone of your post it would imply) that they upset your sensitivities and desire for a sanitised Luxor!
How do you propose to 'clean up the street of these people'? Are they just garbage that should be swept up in the super dooper new road sweepers you'd like to see in Luxor? 'These people' are human beings - not excrement!
As for being richer than the majority of ex pats - very disputable if you are talking in terms of financial wealth, although I'd have to say many possibly are richer in many other ways - but again I couldn't prove that either!

Edit to add - just read the bit quoted again. I am now left wondering if '...the streets need to be cleaned of these people' because 'some are richer than the majority of ex pats.' Certainly food for thought! :roll:
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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Chocolate Eclair » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:14 pm

I have read your reply Hepzibah, but not going to answer, like you say I live here and not Europe but it does not mean to say that standards cannot be improved. That's my final thought on this subject.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by HEPZIBAH » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:35 pm

Chocolate Eclair wrote:I have read your reply Hepzibah, but not going to answer, like you say I live here and not Europe but it does not mean to say that standards cannot be improved. That's my final thought on this subject.
:snig: You just did! :snig:
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Re: Now is the time.

Post by BENNU » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:40 pm

...begging in the streets is totally unacceptable in Europe, so the streets need to be cleaned up of these people...


- So we know where you stand.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Who2 » Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:41 pm

Quote: , a certain hotel, got started but now seems to have stopped, Roca Forte, (OK you may say well there are no tourists) but that will not be forever and many of these Hotels are part of a chain so investment should not be an issue.

See if we still had those milk bars his dad charlie built you could have popped in to ask him why.
It's simple he's done the figures seen the score and the tourists are not returning, so cut your losses and try something else, 'bet you didn't know most their $bucks came from flogging food at Heathrow.....
Me and Rocco where born in the same town but in different hotels, his dad made it my dad went bankrupt again.....:cool:
"The Salvation of Mankind lies in making everything the responsibility of All"
Sophocles.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Chocolate Eclair » Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:43 pm

Yes Bennu, I have no time for beggars, having worked in London and seen the rings of them, making money hand over fist it appalled me. So now Charity begins at home for me, except for the people in my own village. I am not saying they have rings in Luxor, but have been warned by local people that people from other Arabic Countries now living in Luxor are making a good living from begging. When in a coffee shop I look to see if local people give first.

I once offered to join a charity in Luxor, "Oh Yes we will send you the papers, blah blah blah and you can contribute" Never heard another word, so that decided me where my charity is.....

I did not come to Luxor to open a new bank account for every bleeding Tom (This word got edited so have to now put Richard) and Harry, just for the peace and quiet, and a good life shared with my wife.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Remus » Tue Sep 03, 2013 4:57 pm

'Well we are doing our bits in different ways to attract tourism for the future' says CE.

Who is the 'we' in this preposterous sentence?

'We' are ex-pats, guests in a foreign country. 'We' have no right to tell
our hosts anything about the way they should run their country.

As for the comments about street beggars, I find them (being as polite as I can) shameful.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Dusak » Tue Sep 03, 2013 5:16 pm

Begging, for some, is a way of life that has been thrust upon them, without choice, but needed. I suppose I'm lucky, my belly has never been empty, nor have I been forced to sit by the hot dirty road side hoping for a helping hand from a passing stranger. To be honest, I don't think that I could. Need not they worry about power cuts, non delivered parcels or the potholes they have to use as a toilet. They worry if their family members still count the same number at night than they did in the morning when they left to seek help in their dire lives. No food parcels of delights will be delivered by friends from overseas, nor will they ever be in the position to say ''no thank you, I have.'' But the likes of us will always be in a position to help, saying ''your welcome, take it, I have.'' What a selfish, uncompromising and abhorrent life some live under the guise of white supremacy.
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Re: Now is the time.

Post by biosceptic » Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:57 pm

As is often the case, those who exploit the charity/goodwill/help of others when they do not have the need increase public resistance to helping. When everyone is confident that need is real and not being manufactured as a business enterprise people are much more willing to contribute. In your village you can know who is real ad who is on the make. The general public having see other examples of swindles/con tricks/exploitation can be reluctant to contribute if they have no way of judging true need.

In a poorly regulated society it is only sensible for those who feel with every step that they are walking wallets, treat the many demands for help with a touch of suspicion.

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by BENNU » Wed Sep 04, 2013 12:30 am

biosceptic wrote: In a poorly regulated society it is only sensible for those who feel with every step that they are walking wallets, treat the many demands for help with a touch of suspicion.
Yes, and some of us have shared our bad experiences on the forum, but this is more than a touch of suspicion:

"...begging in the streets is totally unacceptable in Europe, so the streets need to be cleaned up of these people..." Chocolate Eclair

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Chocolate Eclair » Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:32 am

I am sorry to say to you people but when we were tourists, apart from the hassle in Luxor, begging came a close second. You do not see hardly any begging on the West Bank and the people in the rural areas are extremely poor. But like most ways the family come together and support each other, for food and alike.

I have told this story on this forum before, so will say it again so you understand, if you don't then I have no problem you coming here and tossing your hard earned cash at beggars in the belief your minds will be satisfied.

My wife and myself were sat in a coffee shop in central Luxor, an old woman came in stick in hand and the other outspread with open palm, we had noticed she had been looking into the coffee shop and walked past it at least 3 times peering in, when she came in she walked past 3 tables of Egyptian people and stuck her open palm in front of my wife, who suddenly felt an almighty tug on her heart strings and gave he 5 le, she went then around the other tables and got nothing. We were finished so we paid our bill and left, on walking out we saw the woman hand over 5le to this man who promptly walked into the next shop and purchased cigarettes, from that day on, never given a empty crisp packet.

Regarding the "We" like you mentioned in your post Remus, I must stress that it was meant in more of a Sarcastic term, I am doing nothing personally, apart from shopping with my wife on a regular basis, enjoying coffee shops on a regular basis, filling the motorbike up on a regular basis, and quite a few other things that require spending money to keep the local economy going while there are no tourists about.

I am sorry to say this and know will get even more stick, but those that have the wool pulled over their eyes by, beggars, the blinding sun and energy sapping heat of Luxor, really do need to come and live here on a full time basis, because by doing so, you can have your mind satisfied by giving your hard earned cash to those that can see a mug coming, it happened to me a few times when I came here, the door is now firmly closed...

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Re: Now is the time.

Post by HEPZIBAH » Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:05 am

Chocolate Eclair wrote:...I am doing nothing personally, apart from shopping with my wife on a regular basis, enjoying coffee shops on a regular basis, filling the motorbike up on a regular basis, and quite a few other things that require spending money to keep the local economy going while there are no tourists about.
You appear to be confused between money that is generated by tourism and that which is generated by normal daily life of those who live in Luxor, be they Egyptian or expats.

Chocolate Eclair wrote:I am sorry to say this and know will get even more stick, but those that have the wool pulled over their eyes by, beggars, the blinding sun and energy sapping heat of Luxor, really do need to come and live here on a full time basis, because by doing so, you can have your mind satisfied by giving your hard earned cash to those that can see a mug coming, it happened to me a few times when I came here, the door is now firmly closed...
I find it somewhat arrogant that you should think that visitors, and even some expats, are walking around blindfolded. If you took your blinkers off you would see that many are not as naive, or stupid, as you seem to think. Giving with a generous heart and discernment is practiced by many, but often very quietly - not letting the left hand see what the right hand is doing. Perhaps they should be applauded, not deplored (not that they are looking for thanks or recognition). Yes, there are those who are always going to be a sucker (in someone else's eyes) for every hand held out to them or hard luck story told them - but that is their nature, not necessarily a fault.

I am not suggesting for one moment that every person who begs - and that comes in many forms on both banks of the Nile (it can be very subtle) - is in genuine need. However, in the majority of cases we do not know the full extent of that need.

Personally, I don't want to see beggers on the streets of Luxor or anywhere else, including my own [perceived to be] rather affluent town. That is not for any reasons of wanting to see 'sanitised' streets, but because I don't want people to have to be in such a position that they find that is their only way to get by. Equally, I am mindful that none of us know our own future and I would hate the thought that any of us should end up in such a situation that it became our only option in life. In this ever changing world nothing is beyond the realms of possibility - including the mighty falling!
Image Experience is not what happens to you;
it is what you do with what happens to you.
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Re: Now is the time.

Post by Remus » Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:25 am

Can I present a different interpretation from the one expressed
above by CE of 'Charity begins at home':

When we are young we are taught to show love and kindliness to those
around us, our parents, our brothers and sisters, our elderly relatives,
our childhood friends, our neighbours etc.

This is where we learn to be 'charitable', thus Charity Begins at Home.

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